[Visitaccess] ramps, inclined planes
Eleanor Smith
eleanors at mindspring.com
Tue Jun 5 13:04:48 EDT 2007
I have never seen anyone walking up steps with a walker. There is not
enough room to place a walker on a riser. If someone who uses a walker
is walking up a stairway, it would appear that some helper is carrying
the walker up or down the stairs for the person.
The world is full of inclined planes and must remain so. The person who
cannot walk up or push a manual wheelchair up an incline of 12%, which
includes many city sidewalks and the great majority of curb cuts, will
not go out alone into the world for long without being stopped by earth
geometry and the human-made inclines that follow or somewhat modify that
geometry (but not to the point of leveling it--which is neither possible
nor desirable). If a 1:12 slope is physically impossible or harmful
for a person with a mobility impairment, they will go out in a manual
wheelchair, with someone who can push them if they cannot push
themselves. Many people at that point will buy a scooter or power
chair for those times when they intend to engage the world outside their
home.
>From a broader perspective, I personally am not very interested in
engaging in debates about whether basic access to virtually all new
homes, with a zero step entrance and wide interior doors as sine qua
non, is desirable. I take that as a given for this Visitability list.
It's my hope that much of the dialog will center on finding and
publicizing NU existing projects that demonstrate good Visitable design;
noting quite openly NU projects that missed opportunities to do that;
advocating and educating to specific NUists we know who are currently
developing residential projects that they design with basic access; and
suggesting/acting to effect ways that CNU can advance Visitability/UD
more explicitly and consistently within the organization. Interested
to hear what others on this list are looking for.
Eleanor
-----Original Message-----
From: visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org
[mailto:visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org] On Behalf Of Bruce F. Donnelly
Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 9:51 AM
To: CNU VisitAccess
Subject: [Visitaccess] FW: Planetizen Article on Accessible Housing
Yes, but cane/walker is actually complicated with
respect to ramps, etc. It's often a toss-up as to
whether people needing them will take stairs or a
ramp. My mother, when she used a walker, preferred a
stairway with a stout railing to a ramp, which could
throw her back out. After her hip replacement, her
doctor told her to avoid ramps for 2 years. A level
entry was best, but then she preferred stairs, and a
ramp was (is) a last resort.
--- Liz <lkormos at nycap.rr.com> wrote:
> I think you are being too narrow to restrict the
> analysis to wheelchair
> users. Anyone who uses a cane or walker is mobility
> impaired and should be
> included in the analysis.
>
> Liz Kormos
> >President
> >Kormos and Company LLC
> >12 Overlook Drive
> >Voorheesville, NY 12186
>
> 518-439-8903
> 518-466-8904 cell
> lkormos at KormosandCompany.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org
> [mailto:visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org] On Behalf
> Of Bruce F. Donnelly
> Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 10:21 AM
> To: CNU VisitAccess
> Subject: Re: [Visitaccess] FW: FW: Planetizen
> Article on Accessible Housing
>
> Fine, but that's not what he asked. What is the
> percentage of people who will need wheelchairs in
> their lifetime? What is the percentage of dwellings
> in which people who use wheelchairs will live? Or,
> since that is probably pretty hard to get, what is
> the
> percentage of people who will be both able-bodied
> enough to live independently _and_ who are in need
> of
> wheelchairs in their lifetimes?
>
> There _is_ an old statistic (1995 or so was the last
> I
> saw) of people who are outside institutions and use
> wheelchairs, but if there's a parallel claim that
> people are being forced into institutions because of
> mobility, then that implies that the percentage of
> people outside institutions using wheelchairs would
> be
> higher if they could find housing that accommodates
> them.
>
> It's not enough to say that the number or percentage
> of people over 65 is going up, because at the same
> time I am hearing that the number of people in each
> age cohort needing mobility assistance is going
> down.
> That is, if we are able to offer hip and knee
> replacements, better prosthetics, direct nerve
> stimulation and robotic exoskeletons (which are
> being
> rolled out in Japan), then the age at which 10% of
> people need wheelchairs will likely go from 82,
> where
> it looks like it is now, to 85 and up.
>
> There must be stats and projections; do you know
> where?
>
>
> --- "Steinfeld, Edward" <arced at buffalo.edu> wrote:
>
> > From: Steinfeld, Edward
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 05, 2007 9:28 AM
> > To: 'Kormos'
> > Subject: RE: [Visitaccess] FW: Planetizen Article
> on
> > Accessible Housing
> >
> >
> >
> > This is a chart from a paper we commissioned:
> >
> >
> >
> > Demographics of Wheeled Mobility Device Users
> >
> >
> >
> > By
> >
> >
> >
> > Mitchell P. LaPlante, Ph.D.
> >
> > Associate Adjunct Professor
> >
> > Dept. of Social and Behavioral Sciences
> >
> > Disability Statistics Center
> >
> > University of California
> >
> > 3333 California Street, Room 340
> >
> > San Francisco, CA 94118
> >
> >
> >
> > October 7, 2003
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Figure 1. Proportion of the population unable to
> or
> > having some
> > difficulty walking by themselves, and use of
> > assistive devices, by age:
> > United States 1995-1997
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > This paper is being updated for publication in a
> > journal. From the graph
> > you can find the incidence of mobility impairment
> at
> > any age.
> >
> >
> >
> > Edward Steinfeld, Arch.D., AIA
> >
> > Professor of Architecture and Director
> >
> > Center for Inclusive Design and Environmental
> Access
> > School of
> > Architecture and Planning
> >
> > University at Buffalo, State University of New
> York
> >
> >
> >
> > Tel. 716 829 3485 (x327)
> >
> > Fax. 716 829 3861
> >
> > email address:arced at buffalo.edu
> >
> > IDEA Center website: www.ap.buffalo.edu/idea
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: Kormos [mailto:lkormos at nycap.rr.com]
> > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 10:23 PM
> > To: Steinfeld, Edward; VisitAccess at cnunext.org
> > Subject: RE: [Visitaccess] FW: Planetizen Article
> on
> > Accessible Housing
> >
> >
> >
> > Edward,
> >
> >
> >
> > Isn't it be possible to calculate statistically
> the
> > probability of being
> > mobility disabled during your adult lifetime. It
> > would be interesting
> > to calculate the probability of both your own
> > disability and also that
> > of having a close family member with a disability
> > (parents, grandparent,
> > child) at any given point in time. Adding that
> > factor would show how
> > common this is in families.
> >
> >
> >
> > This year my 90 year old uncle visited our home in
> a
> > wheel chair. My 84
> > year old father in law walks with a cane and can
> not
> > do stairs. He lives
> > in a retirement community nearby and visits our
> home
> > often staying the
> > weekend. Luckily I built my two story home with
> 36
> > inch wide doors, a
> > single step into the house from the garage (the
> > builder said I couldn't
> > do at grade in 1994) and a first floor study/guest
> > room and first floor
> > full bathroom. The added cost was minimal.
> >
> >
> >
> > Just drive around a typical older neighorhood and
> > see how many people
> > have installed ramps. I just don't understand the
> > resistance from those
> > building new single family construction.
> >
> >
> >
> > Liz Kormos
> > President
> > Kormos and Company LLC
> > 12 Overlook Drive
> > Voorheesville, NY 12186
> >
> > 518-439-8903
> > 518-466-8904 cell
> >
> > lkormos at KormosandCompany.com
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org
> > [mailto:visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org]On Behalf
> Of
> > Steinfeld, Edward
> > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 7:01 PM
> > To: VisitAccess at cnunext.org
> > Subject: [Visitaccess] FW: Planetizen Article on
> > Accessible
> > Housing
> >
> >
> >
> > The % of people who have a mobility impairment is
> > cross
> > sectional data - it doesn't tell us who is at risk
> > or who will
> > eventually have such an impairment over the course
> > of their life. Since
> > houses last a long time, we have to take the long
> > view. The % over 65 IS
> > important because older people have a much high
> > probability of having a
> > mobility impairment than the rest of the
> population.
> > They are a large
> > portion of the population at risk. Moreover, they
> > will drive the market
> > for accessibility because, due to the experience
> > with their parents,
> > this generation is much more aware of the
> importance
> > of access for aging
> > in place.
> >
> >
> >
> > Edward Steinfeld, Arch.D., AIA
> >
> > Professor of Architecture and Director
> >
> > Center for Inclusive Design and Environmental
> > Access School of
> > Architecture and Planning
> >
> > University at Buffalo, State University of New
> York
> >
> >
> >
> > Tel. 716 829 3485 (x327)
> >
> > Fax. 716 829 3861
> >
> > email address:arced at buffalo.edu
> >
> > IDEA Center website: www.ap.buffalo.edu/idea
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> >
> > From: visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org
> > [mailto:visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org] On Behalf
> > Of Bruce F. Donnelly
> > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 6:53 PM
> > To: CNU VisitAccess
> > Subject: Re: [Visitaccess] Planetizen Article on
> > Accessible
> > Housing
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm immediately skeptical when someone uses
> > irrelevant
> > statistics. The percentage of people over 65
> isn't
> > relevant; the
> > percentage of people with mobility disabilities
> is.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Too static <-> "Life" <-> Too noisy
> >
> > --Christopher Langton
> >
> >
> >
> > Bruce F. Donnelly
> >
> >
> >
> > 216 470 9348
> >
> >
> >
> > From: visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org
> > [mailto:visitaccess-bounces at cnunext.org] On Behalf
> > Of Todd McLeod
> > Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 4:02 PM
> > To: visitaccess at cnunext.org
> > Subject: [Visitaccess] Planetizen Article on
> > Accessible Housing
> >
> >
> >
> > The linked article on accessibility for
> > single-family housing
> > was posted to Planetizen last Tuesday, and
> includes
> > a reference to
> > Eleanor Smith and "Concrete Change."
> >
> >
> >
> > http://www.planetizen.com/node/24729
> >
> >
> >
> > Todd McLeod, E.I.
> >
> > Civil Design, Inc.
> >
> > The Guaranty Building
> >
> > 120 S. Olive Ave., Suite 403
> >
> > West Palm Beach, FL 33401
> >
> > Tel: (561) 659-5760 x102
> >
> > Fax: (561) 659-5772
> >
> > Cell: (561) 676-6208
> >
> > tmcleod at civil-design.com
> >
> > www.civil-design.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > Visitaccess mailing list
> > Visitaccess at cnunext.org
> >
>
http://mail.cnunext.org/mailman/listinfo/visitaccess_cnunext.org
> >
>
>
> Yours truly,
>
> Bruce F. Donnelly
>
> (216) 470-9348
>
>
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